Praying nurses

[ciphergoth]

Nurse suspended without pay for offering to pray for a patient during a home visit - what do you think?

(Snowed in today, trying to work from home but it's not really a workplace atmosphere around here today :-)

Updated: the patient is described as a Christian in the article. One wonders if this means Christian as in really a Christian, or "Christian I suppose" which AFAICT is the majority religion of the UK. Updated: actually "have Christian beliefs myself" is more like the phrasing I'd expect from someone who takes it seriously.

Comments

[palmer1984.livejournal.com]

I don't think she should have been suspended without pay. I think treating workers in insecure jobs like this is far worse than potentially offending someone by offering to pray for them.

[alextiefling.livejournal.com]

Indeed! Whilst I'd be touched if I was in a bad way and someone offered to pray for me, I'd find it slightly bothersome from a health professional, and if it kept happening, or it was a hindrance to proper care, I'd rather it weren't done, or at least weren't mentioned.

My arm of the church doesn't put too much emphasis on the power of prayer; God is expected to be a comfort to the afflicted, not a panacea. If I thought my boils (or whatever) were going to be discussed in the nurse's ex tempore prayer meeting, I might well object on the basis of patient confidentiality.

[alextiefling.livejournal.com]

She's a Baptist. I don't think Baptists have nuns.

[palmer1984.livejournal.com]

Although yes, it is mildly innappropriate, and she should have had some sort of written warning.

[purplerabbits.livejournal.com]

It's not so much suspension without pay as that, being a bank nurse, she gets paid for jobs she's sent on and they're not sending her on any...

[ciphergoth.livejournal.com]

That does make a big difference. Still, down with casualization!

[ciphergoth.livejournal.com]

She declined on the spot...

[cookwitch.livejournal.com]

Unless, of course, the patient is a curmudgeonly old moo who complains about everything. Not that there are any people like that at all.

[purplerabbits.livejournal.com]

The Guardian article makes it clear that the nurse offers to pray for patients on a regular basis and considers it a valuable part of the care she gives, which bothers me, since I don't think a reprimand would work. If she loses her job because she refuses to stop telling/asking patients she's praying for them, I don't have a problem with that, it sounds like a suspension is the only way to make her stop while they think about it.

And as almost no-one has said, though I don't like people saying "I'm not offended but someone might me" I can totally understand how a 70+ year old housebound person might use that form of words out of fear of being too much trouble or causing offence.

[misterfallen.livejournal.com]

Meh. I can see as how someone would take it badly, but I think if someone offered to do that for me, I'd be quite touched, whether I shared their faith or not. Unless they were offering to do it instead of treat me...

Oh, and a girl called Selene asked me to say hi from herself, Ben and Alex... :)

[ciphergoth.livejournal.com]

That's no exception. If they complain, you got it wrong. If they're the sort of person who complains about everything, you should know better than to offer to pray for them.

[ciphergoth.livejournal.com]

Hello Selene! Long time no see!

[prolificdiarist.livejournal.com]

I think that suspension without pay still seems excessive. But can't she just pray to get her job back?

Hahaha, brilliant :)

Kx

[ciphergoth.livejournal.com]

Your second para makes a valuable point!

[runesandmen.livejournal.com]

Difficult, I do agree with cookwitch above, you don't need to tell someone that you are going to pray for them. My mother regularly prays for patients. She never tells them though. Just sends little prayers up from time to time. Faith tends to be a fairly private and personal thing that you don't really talk about in work but it affects every part of your life, including work but in a private way. That probably didn't make any sense, sorry. Saying a wee prayer at the end of your working day in private won't really do anyone any harm but talking about it could be offensive to people of different faiths/no belief so prayer-offering was a bit clumsy.

There are dedicated people in medicine to support people in a spiritual way, ie hospital chaplains. You always get the option of seeing one as an inpatient and they do good work. Probably best to leave it to them and have the nursing treatment religion-free. I know the patient in question is being treated in the community so that's not really the issue but if she was wanting spiritual support, which she clearly didn't, referring her to such a dedicated professional, such as her own minister, would be the best plan.

[cookwitch.livejournal.com]

Not so.

Would you like me to pray for you?
No, thank you dear.
Fair enough.

I cannot see what is so awful about that, I really can't. We're turning into a nation of "It might OFFEND someone! Aaiiee!" people.

It's not like she held her down and tried to exorcise her.

Plus just because someone complains, does not always mean that YOU have got it wrong.

[johncoxon.livejournal.com]

New Scientist has reported studies that showed that a couple of times IIRC, tried looking there?

[johncoxon.livejournal.com]

If she's evangelising to sick people, that's not on. Simply offering to pray for someone is perfectly acceptable, though.

[andrewducker]

Declining politely is fine though. If a nurse offered to pray for me in casual conversation then I'd politely decline - and I wouldn't report her later, because she hadn't offended me.

[djm4]

Would you feel the same way about someone who complained because the nurse hadn't offered to pray for them? (Note - I'm not saying this is exactly equivalent, just trying to gauge boundaries.)

[johncoxon.livejournal.com]

Declining on the spot isn't offence. If someone offered me a cup of tea, I'd instantly decline because I hate tea, but that doesn't make me offended. In fact, I'd be pleased that they'd considered the fact I might want them to make me one - same logic applies here. Just because you don't want a prayer said for you doesn't imply that anyone who offers will offend you. Unless you're really touchy, I guess.

[palmer1984.livejournal.com]

If they complain, you got it wrong.

Does that apply to anything? When I was working in a pub I got a fair few complaints from awful people without doing anything wrong.

[misterfallen.livejournal.com]

She's living in Epsom now...working at Croydon college. She does kung fu with me about one night a week. :)

[palmer1984.livejournal.com]

Also, generally I think people who complain are wankers. I'd put up with all kinds of rudeness from restaurant staff, for instance, rather than complaining and potentially costing someone their job.

I do think that it's a bit different for a nurse who's taking care of people, but the offense seems very small.

[ciphergoth.livejournal.com]

No, not at all - if you do it by the book and they complain, you can say, I did it by the book. If you do exactly what the book forbids, you'd better be right about them welcoming it.